There seem to be quite a lot of people of the mind that there's no point in having communities, forums, and blogs relating to childfreedom. At least, that's the impression I'm getting. I've seen numerous comments around the web, especially lately, ranging from wonder to why our communities exist to anger and defensiveness at the existence of them. Well, if they think we don't need them, do they think the same thing about mommy blogs and parenting forums? Pet communities? Blogs, forums and communities relating to cooking, music, sports, and video games? No, I'm sure they don't.
I've heard that we shouldn't revel in being childfree. But by that train of thought, maybe they shouldn't revel in being parents or sports enthusiasts.
Fact of the matter is, we need support (and places to talk to like-minded people) just as much as, or even more than, parents or anyone else. Our choice is often looked down on, questioned, and attacked. Why shouldn't we have safe spaces to talk to other people without having to deal with a parent jumping in constantly to try to bring attention to their kid? If we were to try to tell a parent like that to stay on topic and stop bringing up their kids, we'd be jumped on by just about every person in the thread and it would be turned into an 'attack the childfree' free-for-all; I've seen it happen, and I've had it happen to me. No matter how polite you are, you're still suddenly labeled a bitter, horrible child-hater. (Is it any wonder, then, when some childfree people do end up saying to hell with being nice? Seems, sometimes, like there's no point trying if we're going to be attacked either way.)
Why shouldn't we have safe places to rant if something annoyed us regarding children or shitty parenting? Trying to rant about bad parents or bratty children on a general forum tends to only get people jumping on the "well you're just a bitter childless baby-hater" or "you're not a parent so you don't know how haaaard it is" bandwagon. Trust me, I've tried. It just ends in frustration and angry, bitter feelings where they weren't any to begin with.
Hell, just trying to bring up anything childfree on a general forum tends to lead to parents and wannabe parents diving in to attack without mercy; it's like we're magnets. They zero in on the things they perceive as personal attacks (read: anything at all that infers a person doesn't absolutely looooove da wittle babbies and/or have or want any of their own) and then that's it for the childfree person/people involved. Maybe it's just the forums I lurk on, but I've yet to see a CF topic remain alive and un-attacked by parents for very long.
Why shouldn't we have places we can go to if we want to share something that we experienced? How many people on a general forum are going to care if one of us manages to get sterilized? The only people who care are the people who also want it done and know how hard it can be to achieve. Childfree love hearing about sterilization success stories. Parents don't; they don't care, either because they think we're insane for not wanting kids and will regret it one day - and they'll jump in and ruin the mood by saying so - or because they think it's as easy as going to a doctor, saying "sterilize me" and it will happen. We know better - what a struggle it is to find a doctor who will take us serious, who won't be a condescending asshole, will actually consider that we do know what we want.
What's wrong with being able to get support from like-minded people? If we're getting bingoed left and right, or need advice on bringing up our childfree status with loved ones, or finding a CF-friendly doctor, who better to help us than people who've gone through it themselves? I wouldn't ask a parent for advice on things like that.
And sometimes we just need the knowledge that we aren't alone in our choices. When I was growing up, I was the only one I knew of who didn't want kids of my own one day. I was always told I would change my mind. My mom told me that there were people who didn't want kids so I should stop worrying about it. But I couldn't, because I didn't know any of these mythical "don't want kids" people. Everyone I knew said, "Oh, I said the same thing when I was your age! Look at me now! I have kids and I LOOOOOVE them more than anything! You'll change your mind, too." I was sure those were the people she was talking about and she just wanted me to shut up (she wouldn't have kept hearing about it, though, if she hadn't kept up with the "one day when you have kids..."-type shit). I think, among other things, the feeling of being so alone contributed to my depression and social anxiety.
Who likes feeling isolated? But of course, I knew things wouldn't be any better if I ignored my feelings and just followed the crowd. I was stuck between a rock and a hard place. When I stumbled on the term "childfree", I was in awe. There really were other people like me. Finding communities and forums full of people who stood by their choice not to have children, and blogs written by childfree individuals, and being able to communicate with them made a huge difference in my life.
I do still feel isolated in real life. I'm surrounded by parents. My choice is often questioned, attacked, belittled by those around me, and some days it's almost unbearable...but I have like-minded people I can reach out to online. They understand what I'm going through. And now I can extend that same lifeline, like they did for me.
I wonder...do parents not want us to have that support, so that maybe we'll give in and have kids, and join them in their misery? Is that it? Or do they feel attacked somehow? Odd, that one, when society bows down so much to parents and kids.
I guess the whole thing can just be boiled down to one more of the many double-standards that some people throw out there for the childfree.
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Hi Kita
ReplyDeleteJust wanted to say how much I appreciated your thoughtful and insightful piece. As someone childfree-by-circumstance, but who was pretty sure in my early 20's that I didn't 'want' children, only to fall in love, get married and want them very much indeed, I have to confess that I do sometimes wonder if young childfree women will 'change their mind one day' (I just don't say it out loud and work from a totally unrepresentative sample of one ... me!) Your piece rang so true, and your determination feels so clear to you that it's helped me understand that it's a very clear choice for some women. I respect that, and I admire you for speaking so honestly about it.
These days, (aged 47) having got through the experience of wanting a child and not being able to have one, and then not being in the 'right' situation to have one post-divorce, and now finding myself out the other side and absolutely fine without children, I am beginning to look back on my years of 'baby-hunger' with a slightly different view.... And I'm finding the way that some (online) parents look at (online) childfree by choice women as very odd and polarized. But that's also partly a function of the anonymity of the internet I think...
If you'll allow me to digress... for about 4 years I ate a vegan diet. I preferred not to tell people, unless it was strictly necessary, as they would often start interrogating me about my food choices - usually whilst I was eating. They would attack me, expect me to explain myself, get heated about things. One day, tired from this, and quite out of character I said "just let me eat, will you? I can't be bothered to justify my plate anymore to someone who's actually not in the slightest bit interested in why I choose to eat this way, but who's actually just exercised about the fact that my choice seems to remind them of a choice of their own that they'd rather not look at."
And I think there's something of that flavour going on in the parent/childfree 'debate' (I put it in inverted commas because sometimes it's not worthy of the word 'debate').
*NEWSFLASH* Being a parent isn't all wonderful, all the time. Being childfree isn't all wonderful, all the time. Each have their rewards, each have their price.
I still wish I could have had a family, but I don't believe that my usefulness to society, and to making the world a better place, is null and void because of it. I'm a loving, kind, thoughtful, nurturing person (most of the time!) There's a lot I can, have & will do to share that with others.
Once again, many thanks for your piece. You are thoughtful young woman and the world is blessed by your presence. That doesn't mean you have to have a baby to say thank you. You are enough just the way you are. Do your thing. Motherhood's not going out of fashion anytime soon so the human race will manage!!! It's got more pressing problems to deal with anyway! Worrying about a small percentage of the human race who choose not to have children is like rearranging deckchairs on the Titantic! However, knowing that doesn't make the mean-spirited and thoughtless comments from parents any less hurtful for you, which makes me sad.
Sending you my very best wishes,
Jody x
http://www.gateway-women.com
When someone I used to care about, respect and looked up to went on and on for years about never wanting kids, found herself pregnant and suddenly blogged daily about wanting to lose her first baby weight so she could get pregnant again, I dropped her immediately. I couldn't deal with the betrayal of how she put down children and mothers all over the place online for almost a decade, and then was careless enough to let her Fort Knox get all Fort Knocked up. She now loves and revels in being a mother, much like a pig in shit. (Sorry - I know it's a bad comparison, but it's the only thing I can come up with that matches right now.)
ReplyDeleteWhen a former co-worker went on and on for the two years we worked together, and for years after we didn't, about how she hated kids, didn't bother or didn't have the guts to tell me she got pregnant after I moved away (I found out through her email forward about her being out the office for 6 months on mat leave), I lost faith in all of my close female friend who stated as ardently as these two did they don't want kids. Not on a personal level, but on a fundamental women's level. We who chose not to have kids and mean it don't deserve to be betrayed by those who stood up with us to other women only to have them change their (I assume) matured minds, values and views of how they want to live their lives one day like that. I can only liken them to Anne Heche who was straight, then gay, and then straight again, and had kids with two different men.
It's a total slap in the face to us on one hand and a total giving the right to parents to say, "Told you you'd change your mind and that you secretly did want kids all along," on the other" Now all smug, insulting parents will think of us as liars and fakes because we're denying the world our loin fruits (or something equally stupid). I couldn't stop talking to either of these two staunch modern women with womb choices fast enough. I now second guess everything both of them ever said to me or did in my presence. I can't help but think I really didn't know either of them, and I'm mad at myself for wasting my precious time and energy getting to know them and sharing with them as much as I did. Clearly both were in some kind of deep denial, but boy, did I buy into their delusion, too.
I really hate that, because of women who did what they did so publicly, others like me will probably never be taken seriously by the world as a whole. At least when I made my choice not to have kids, it only affected me, and my husband. What these two did affects every woman in the world. Thanks a lot, you selfish assholes!
I know what you mean. Most people don't take us seriously because so many people loudly proclaim they don't want kids, and then turn around and have them later. My own mom did that. She said for years that she didn't want kids (but apparently always wanted a boy and a girl. How much sense does that make? 9_9) and then had me when she was in her late 20's. Now I have a lot of family members telling me, "Oh, but your mom said the same thing! Just wait until you're the age she was, and you'll see!"
ReplyDeleteFortunately, with some of my real-life friends, they haven't said anything that could be thrown at me later. One doesn't really want kids, but has said if she changed her mind she would adopt (pregnancy would be very, very dangerous for her.) Another doesn't particularly want kids, either, but is leaving her options open and just says "not right now"/"maybe in a few years" when asked. Since neither of them is 100% sure either way, they aren't making any sort of declarations about it.
If either of them were as vocally CF as me and ended up changing their minds, I'd probably doubt everything else they'd ever told me, like you did your friends. It would be hard not to, seeing someone change their mind about something like that, especially like you said, after thinking you knew them so well.
I know some people aren't as sure of being childfree as I am; I have two close friends who aren't completely sure if they want kids or not, though they're leaning towards my side of the fence at the moment. I consider myself very fortunate that it was such a clear choice for me (especially since I have a tendency to be indecisive about a lot of things; unless it's a clear choice from the beginning I can take months or years to make a decision).
ReplyDeleteI'm actually vegetarian myself, and I've faced much the same kind of interrogation as you. It is pretty similar to the whole thing between parents and childfree. It's a shame that people can't just accept that what is the right choice for one person, may not be the right choice for someone else. Life isn't some one-size-fits-all mold and everyone's circumstances, beliefs and feelings are different.
"Worrying about a small percentage of the human race who choose not to have children is like rearranging deckchairs on the Titantic!"
This is the best comparison I have ever heard, partly because it's so true, and partly because of the visual.
As hurtful as some of the mean comments can be (and I won't deny that they do hurt, sometimes a lot), every nice comment - like yours - more than makes up for it.
oh god in heaven, mighty flying spaghetti monster, hope i won't be like THOSE women...
ReplyDeleteI feel like I can completely relate to your blog! I just started my own blogger space regarding an issue similar to this. As a childfree couple, my husband I have a difficult time maintaining friends. It seems that when people have children, we're not "relatable" anymore. I find this funny, as I do perhaps wants children LATER on! Haha! And like you mentioned, I hate those who tell you "you'll change your mind" or "you'll want children soon". Ugh!
ReplyDeleteGreat article! I'm off to read some of your other posts!
I can relate. It's even more difficult when you're under 18 and people are less likely to take you seriously because "you have more time to change your mind". Um, no. I have no where to go either because even people in the CF community reject me because I'm a "bratty teenager" and so far, I haven't found a single like minded person who is around my age that can understand. I'm isolated and feel slightly discriminated against. Am I really the only minor who stands firm in their choice? Sigh.
ReplyDeleteSorry about the late reply; I haven't been on the internet much lately. It is definitely difficult when you're still a teenager. No one took me seriously - even my own parents - until I hit 20, and even now (nearly 22) I'm still getting "you'll change your mind" comments. It'll probably continue until I'm old and gray.
ReplyDeleteAnd actually, you would have somewhere to go if you're on LiveJournal: young-and-cf.livejournal.com. It's my community and it's a bit dead at the moment, though I'm planning to wake it back up. You're more than welcome to come join =). Teens are certainly welcome there - providing they're capable of sounding like mature, rational individuals, instead of baboons with typewriters (in other words, using chatspeak) - because plenty of us who are CF have known our entire lives that we don't want kids. Part of the reason I created that community was so that those of us who are at the younger end of the CF spectrum have somewhere to go.
I feel like I could have written this post myself!!! Well said, even though I am coming in rather late. Looking forward to reading more of your blog ;)
ReplyDeleteHey hey hey:-)
ReplyDeleteDenmark here!
We have a law that says every woman have a right to get sterilized for free after the age of 25. I took advantage of that march the 20. 2012 at the young age of 27. Would have done it sooner, but have a shitty doctor who would feed me with Zoloft instead:-/
Then I ratted my doctor out to a higher institution and finally got a go ahead for the operation:-)
But.... My surgeon (who was a man btw) was so reluctant to do it, that I might as well could have asked him to strangle a bunch of kittens instead and he told me that he only performed this surgery because the law said that I have a right to do it.
Heehee, so I was sooo cheerful entering the operation room, actually I just wanted to cry, but I feared that he (the surgeon) would take it as a sign of doubt and stop the whole thing. I got through it and even though the surgeon came up to my bed afterwards and told me that he hoped I was happy with what I've done to my body, I still wanted to hug him:-) HARD! But a hug none the less.
The relief I felt was huge and I'm really happy for my operation. Sure, I can't tell anyone because of the taboo, but for now I'm just happy for not playing russian roulette with my uterus anymore:-)
Sincerly
Anne Stenkjaer
Sterilized and smiling